Best Practices for Supporting International Students

Ashley Safranski:

Welcome, everyone. My name’s Ashley Safranski. I’m the head of marketing here at uConnect. I’ve been doing a lot of these webinars, so if this is not your first webinar, it’s good to see you again, and nice to meet you for those who are joining for the first time. Really want to just say thanks to everyone for carving out time to join us. I know this time of year is often very crazy, so I hope the summer has been treating everyone well and that the start of the school year is either underway and going well or soon will be.

So I’m super excited to be joined by Nitin Agarwal from Interstride. We’re really going to dig into the topic of how career centers can kind of up their support for international students. Interstride is actually one of our headline partners for our Curation Kit that’s focused on supporting international students. So we are super grateful to have Nitin joining us and sharing all of his insights and expertise. Nitin, do you want to introduce yourself and just tell us a bit about Interstride?

Nitin Agrawal:

Yeah, thank you, Ashley, for inviting me and the uConnect team for all the great work you guys have been doing. Very happy about our partnership with uConnect. There’s some other features that are coming as well, but thank you everyone for joining today. I hope this is a productive use of your time for the next 30 minutes or so.

My name is Nitin. I’m one of the co-founders of Interstride. A little bit about my background, I came to the US as an international student, so I was on F-1 visa for maybe eight years. Came in 2002 as an undergrad student at the University of Miami. After my undergraduate education, I pursued investment banking, which took me to New York. I was in New York for a few years. Fast-forward, and this was right during the financial recession, there was no avenue to get green card sponsorship from the banks because they had taken bailout money. So I had to pivot. And for me, the natural pivot as a business student was to pursue my MBA.

Luckily, I got into the MBA program at Berkeley. Again, I was back on F-1 visa. This time when I graduated, the financial crisis was still prevalent, so there were very few opportunities for international students. Luckily, because of the alumni network that came out of Haas from Berkeley, I was able to find a job with the Norwegian Investment Fund in Brazil. So I worked in Brazil for a few years. I worked in Oslo and Norway for a couple of years. But what that did was it allowed me to reenter the US on an L-1 visa, which are intra company transfer visa. And so you bypass the H-1B lottery altogether. And because of that L-1 visa, I received my green card very easily. Once I received my green card, I was working for a tech company then for a few years and which got me thinking about my own experiences and challenges, and that’s where we started Interstride. So today we are working with a number of different institutions, a lot of familiar names here, but very excited about this chat and to share my personal story as well.

Ashley Safranski:

You have had quite the journey, and I always love hearing about people’s path to get where they are currently. And I think that’s one of the beautiful parts about working with career services, is that very rarely is the path linear and there’s lots of elements to the journey along the way. So appreciate you sharing that.

Before I jump into the questions, just a bit of background. I think the context is going to be helpful. Our goal at uConnect is to help career services teams increase engagement, consolidate and increase engagement with the wide range of resources and tools and opportunities that they’re providing to their students to make sure that they have open access to relevant information specific to interests, backgrounds, circumstances, or academic pursuits of course.

Schools are using uConnect in different ways to drive engagement with all student groups, including international students. One of the ways we’re doing this is through Curation Kits, kind of the topic of this conversation related to international students. Curation Kits, they’re a turnkey solution that provides a ton of content supporting specific student populations. And as I mentioned, Interstride is the headline partner for our international kit.

So very, very quickly, I just want to show, because I think it’s important to visualize what I’m talking about so you can see where the Interstride content is coming in. This is Concord University, their international community. And you can see different pieces of content from different providers. So here’s two right off the bat from Interstride, which is really cool. Here’s an upcoming event coming in also provided by Interstride.

So just wanted to showcase that because I think it’s again important just to have that context. And hopefully that’s available. And I think my colleague, Meredith, will drop a link to that. And there she is. I don’t even have to see. We’re just on the same vibe.

So anyway, I think now we can finally get into the questions. So I think a good place to start in it and would be, I think generally it’s well known that international students have just often a different experience getting here and just different challenges or hurdles that perhaps they have to deal with compared to their domestic peers. Can you just talk at a high level about some of the unique experiences and challenges that international students often have to face, I guess, related to pursuing post-secondary education?

Nitin Agrawal:

Yeah, I mean, right off the bat, even coming to the US, or not just the US but Canada or Australia, international education is somewhat of a lottery process because you have no idea if you’ll even receive an F-1 visa or the student visa for that respective country. Whenever you apply for these student visas, the consulate in that country will always ask you for ties to your home country. So what these embassies and consulates want is the student goes, pursues the education, and the students return back home to contribute to their country. But obviously part of the allure of international education is if you are spending that much money, because imagine someone in rupees converting their money to US dollars, there’s a huge investment upfront if you are not in scholarships and which international students are not necessarily privy to. There’s a little bit of this ROI on education which you want to recover, whether it’s through internships, through opportunities.

So right off the bat, when students come to the US, they are looking for these internships, these full-time opportunities. But that differs a little bit from the level of education as well. If you’re a graduate student, you are a little bit more prepared, you maybe have some work experiences under your belt. Undergrad, international student, generally they’ll come in with very limited knowledge of what the job search process is.

So as a career advisor, it’s important to even look at that differently because not all students are alike. So just focusing on those different demographics and the countries they come from, the income status, and all those really factor in when students are looking opportunities. But the major challenges are, again, the immigration piece, whether work authorization, so a limited understanding of these work authorizations. So if a student is educated early on in the process, they have more time to utilize that work experience. If someone comes to the career office third year or fourth year, there’s very limited time for a career advisor even to educate them.

And on the flip side, sometimes career advisors are… There’s this feeling that immigration laws are constantly changing, but the truth is it’s not changing. It takes a lot to change immigration laws, right? The H-1B has been there for years. And the reason that doesn’t change is because you need both House and the Senate to approve to go into law. So there’s not a lot of changes there, but career advisors can get up to speed by working with the ISSS peers to make sure that they’re aware of all these nuances around supporting international students.

Ashley Safranski:

I think you dug into this a little bit, and I think I love what you said about getting international students to engage with career early. And I think that’s something that we talk a lot about for all student populations, just the importance of familiarizing yourself with the career office right off the bat and you’re just setting yourself up for success long-term. Are there any other factors or considerations that international students have to work through? I mean, there are several of course, but related to the career exploration process.

Nitin Agrawal:

So an important factor is also thinking through the experience. When you are applying to institutions, the admission offices is very proactive and highlighting opportunities. It’s the way to get students to attend that institution and fight among different institutions that are competing for maybe the same student. And suddenly when… So a student might come with an idea that, “Oh, I’m attending XYZ University, it’s a strong brand. I’m in Boston, I’m in San Francisco. There are so many companies.” But the reality couldn’t be far from that, right?

And so once students arrive, their expectations have to be level set by the career office. And the career office tends to be the villain in this case where suddenly now they have to tell the students how difficult it is or put this reality. So if that’s done in a delicate way, right off the bat, when during orientation was like, “Look, as international students, it’s not that easy and things can get challenging. But if you’re on top of it, here’s your plan A, here’s your plan B, here’s your plan C.” So highlighting that can also can make those students feel comfortable over time about the difficulty of the journey. Because you’re right, I mean there are a lot of nuances when it comes to hiring and mainly so from the immigration side of things. But just again, highlighting and making it transparent and finding a way to connect with these students without threatening them or making them even more anxious. That’s a little bit of an art, a little bit of a science, but that’s what I think a good career advisor can connect with those students.

Ashley Safranski:

Yeah, definitely level setting expectations without… It’s already such an experience coming to a new country for college. And then you don’t want to burst any bubbles, but I think being a realist is definitely helpful. I think to double click into that a little bit, can you share maybe some ideas or just suggestions for how career teams can tailor programming and resources to better meet the needs of international students both early on in the process and throughout the journey?

Nitin Agrawal:

Yeah, so part of the programming depends on the type of industry students are looking at, type of job opportunities. It might totally be possible that half your students want to return back home. So I’m making a huge generalization year where a large majority, because across the board, obviously a large percentage of international students want to stay in the US, pursue internships and full-time opportunity, but just understanding your certain demographic a little bit better, their needs. And so it could be even surveys that are sent to us, like, “What are your long-term goals? What is your objective from pursuing this education?” And based on that, then even routing students. Because one of the biggest mistakes students make is they’ll take majors and degrees that have no possibility of sponsorship, right?

Ashley Safranski:

Mm-hmm.

Nitin Agrawal:

I mean, if you look at data, it clearly favors STEM degrees and analytics and business degrees. But then if your arts and humanities, I mean not that there’s anything, you’re competing with a lot of local talent as well, domestic talent. So what programming could be put in place at the beginning of that journey where you nudge the student to say, “Hey, look, if this is what you’re looking for, maybe this is not the right option.” So that’s something that then doesn’t orient the student in the wrong direction right off the bat. And throughout the journey then, it’s a little bit of a partnership with the ISSS office as well, because again, career advisors aren’t immigration experts and you can’t expect them to know all these nuances around policies. And then on top of that, if you give wrong advice, you’re in trouble. So just making sure the information that you’re providing is aligned with your ISSS office, your international student office, and they’re your partners when it comes to dispensing anything related to work authorizations.

One other point is around, say for example, H-1B sponsorship or OPT STEM or beyond the post-graduation work experience. So very few students understand what the H-1B lottery process is, what happens between OPT and H-1B, what are exempt employers. So students don’t even need to go get into the lottery process if they work for, say, higher ed institutions, nonprofits. Not the easiest places to find jobs, obviously, but that’s an option. So just also knowing what those options are and exposing all that information to student in a digestible way, I think, yeah, those are some of the things that career advisors can really hone in on.

Ashley Safranski:

Yeah. And I think that the digestible way kind of points me back to part of what we’re trying to accomplish with the Curation Kit. So a couple things, just follow up. So there was a comment from Jane, which I just think is huge. “I used to work in new student recruitment at a large public school, so I can relate to this, but just highlighting career services can also work with international admissions or recruitment for that free enrollment phase and really helping to set realistic expectations.” And perhaps like you said, even surveying incoming international students before they even come and getting a sense of what are goals or what are the academic interests can maybe help you tailor as you plan out programming for the year.

If we were to do some role playing, and if I were an international student coming down, if you’re a career counselor and I sit down with you, what are some questions, a few questions right off the bat you as a career advisor could ask me as an international student to get a baseline of understanding of how to guide them? What are just some good questions to start with?

Nitin Agrawal:

First and foremost would be, do you have any professional experiences? And so that would depend, again, if you’re an undergrad student or a graduate student, right? At a grad level, you are expected to have a little bit of experience at least. But if you don’t and you say your response is, “No, I don’t have any experiences,” maybe consider on-campus employment or some sort of a research project or working with your faculty. I wouldn’t push the student towards an internship right away or, “Here’s a job board. Start looking for jobs.” [inaudible 00:16:19] what’s an easy way to get students comfortable with the US professional environment to get some experience to understand what is it like to work with Americans?

One of the not easy or non-challenging way is to work on-campus because it’s a familiar environment, it’s a familiar setting. And that could be your stepping stone to now the next level, which is an internship. Once you pursue an internship, it could even be unpaid because, again, as an international student, sometimes getting that first internship could be very challenging. “So here’s a list of companies that are looking for talent.” Who doesn’t want free resource, especially if you’re a smart kid. And so why don’t you work for a couple of months, put it on your resume, build it up, and then we’ll look for summer internship.

If I were to advise, I would really try to build up that resume. Some students are connected. Not everyone’s coming with a completely empty slate. So if they have network back home, so they come from a privileged background, maybe they could do a private equity so they don’t have to necessarily work in the US, but get some tangible resume that they can use it for their full-time experience. So if they work for Nestle or Procter & Gamble back home, that translates really well to even a large US employer here. So they don’t necessarily need to intern here, but that’s where the questions would revolve around what the student has in terms of the past background, what has their experience has been so far, and then really guiding them to what they can build on top of that.

Ashley Safranski:

I have a question down here that I think is super related. Obviously, not all students, as you’ve mentioned, aspire to continue to stay in the United States and work. But for those who do, how can career teams help international students overcome cultural barriers in the job search process such as networking and interviewing?

Nitin Agrawal:

Yeah. So I think networking is just one of those things. And even from my personal experience, I mean when I first arrived in the US, I thought networking had something to do with ethernet cables, which was the network, right? I had no idea that you could just reach out to random people and they would be willing to help you because that idea was just so new.

And so things have changed. It’s much easier to network these days with LinkedIn. And LinkedIn I don’t think even existed when I was in school, or maybe it was just taking off. But it’s just providing a little bit of etiquette because it’s almost like it’s not scary anymore to send a message to someone. And students are familiar in terms of social media and sending, so it’s the same thing. How can you make it easy for the other party to hop on a call or exchange information with each other?

So what we tend to advise students is have a Calendly link for 15 minutes, reach out to school alumni on LinkedIn, find someone who’s maybe had international experience or is a former international student and have a scripted text to say why you want to speak to them. And if they are willing to speak to you, just… So really making it easy rather than making them feel that you have to go to a company, have a coffee with this person or maybe a dinner. So you take out that fear of in-person meetings. But once students have done a little bit of this, then that natural confidence comes in. It’s no different than working out where you have to lift five pounds before you lift 50 pounds. So just starting off with small steps and then allowing them to breathe naturally.

Ashley Safranski:

Yeah, I love that. Again, that goes back to engaging early, that really gives students the time needed to build upon those different stepping stones. There’s a question here that I think is a great one and very relevant to this part of the discussion.

“Any advice for working with employers who may be reluctant to hire international students or just generally maybe under or misinformed? How can we as career teams help create more opportunities?”

Nitin Agrawal:

Yeah. So that’s a great question. Honestly, I don’t think there’s a way to convince employers to hire international students. It’s not that any employer is desperate other than some of these really heavy tech related talent who they need to fill in their seats and they are looking for anyone with… So really, people who are going to be target employers for international students are those employers where there’s a shortage of domestic talent and where international students can fill that void.

So those are employers, but then there might be small or midsize employers that are open to hiring international students. They just don’t know how. In that case, I mean it’s just a matter of extending any immigration attorney would be more than happy to speak to an employer because they’ll be the one paying for the services. So most immigration attorney that we work with, they provide 30-minute free consultation. So every career office can have one or two names of immigration attorneys next to their campus in their pocket. And if, say, an employer is interested, like, “Here, we can connect you,” they can explain to you how easy it is. And you don’t get anything unless you decide to sponsor a candidate.

So the takeaway here is, you should have basic knowledge of what it takes to hire international students. You should have an immigration attorney in your Rolodex at least couple. And then just understanding the motivation of the employer because otherwise it’s a little bit of a wild goose chase where you have no idea why you’re pushing an international students to do this work.

Ashley Safranski:

Yeah, sure. I’m not sure if this is a quick question or not, but just related to what you just shared, “Can you comment on how this advice regarding career options and connections with employers can be implemented with post-docs who are mostly on J-1 visas and are no longer students?”

Nitin Agrawal:

With J-1, it gets, I think, tricky a little bit. And I don’t want to speak too much on that because again, I’m no legal expert here, but J-1s have to return home. It’s a training program. So they might be able to work for a little time, but again, if you’re looking for a long-term three year or five years, then they have to switch that visa category. And I don’t think from J-1, you can jump directly to H-1B. But again, please don’t quote me on that. I’m not the expert there, but that’s where it gets a little bit tricky with the J-1.

Ashley Safranski:

You mentioned earlier a lot of students are coming in, especially maybe graduate students and above with previous experience. But even for those who don’t, who are undergrads and pursuing internships or on-campus employment, what are some best practices for helping international students identify and articulate transferable skills gained from their home countries?

Nitin Agrawal:

Again, it really depends because first of all, what did you gain from your home country? A lot of students will talk about languages or their regional experience. Again, it has to be relevant to the job. So say you’re working for a Midwestern bank that doesn’t require any language skills. You’re not serving the diaspora in the US, you’re not engaging in international business, you can’t just say you speak five languages and hope that’ll give you a return there because it’s not needed for the job.

So part it is the ability to adapt. I mean, just because you’ve left your country, you’ve come to the US, you are adapting in a foreign environment. And so if questions like that arise in interview or something around, you can always pitch that as an example. But it has to be somewhat tied because we’re also, as an economy and as a developed economy, we’re in a very skill-based environment. So just generalist comments, just making your resume fluffy with a lot of description around accomplishments is not going to… Ultimately, if you’re working for a tech company, you need to have some background in that space to get that job, right? So just because you say, “Okay, I’ve worked for an ed tech company in China,” sometimes that’s not even enough because that’s a very different market from where we are.

So I take that with a little bit of a grain of salt where, “Okay, you have international experiences that does prove few things like your adaptability and your international experience and so forth, but that doesn’t mean it takes you very far in terms of where.” So you have to have that professional backing to make sure you’re actually a strong candidate.

Ashley Safranski:

Question from Christina in the chat, and I saw this in the Q&A box too. “Earlier you mentioned this idea around setting international students up with accurate information and just level setting expectations, especially sometimes related to the academic field of study. It’s probably not uncommon for students to end up in the career center after they’re enrolled and they’ve been recruited and all of that stuff and they’re in a program of study and can’t change. What are your suggestions for career coaching international students in those fields of the arts and humanities or things outside of technology, business, STEM?”

Nitin Agrawal:

Great question. I think that’s a challenge for career offices everywhere. One thing I would suggest to the student is to look at maybe doing a minor in, say, business or certain tech background, which can combine really well. So say for example, you’re a psychology student. And obviously there’s a lot of domestic talent that is pursuing psychology, for example. But you combine that with a minor in user design or user interface, now suddenly your profile becomes very powerful for a tech company because you have a psychology background backed by user experience minor.

So just looking at those angles in terms of… And then where are the jobs for international students? So with an eye on that. So it’s a little bit of just nuances where they can pivot towards. But just having that, say, a student is pursuing English literature, and obviously it’ll be difficult to compete with an American who’s studied literature just because of the visa sponsorship component, so then the question is, “Look, it’s going to be difficult. And highlighting those challenges, but a student’s already made that decision, there’s nothing a career advisor… It wasn’t their fault.” So exposing the student to the difficulties of what’s to come.

So it’s not last minute, whereas like a student is suddenly graduating and there’s been false promises all along to say, “Oh yeah, you’re a stellar candidate and you’ll find your H-1B sponsorship.” But just level setting the expectation that, “Look, it is hard with this degree, but these are things you can do.”

Ashley Safranski:

Sure. I want to go back to… I think this keeps coming back to the theme of engaging early and having the opportunity to support those students early and often.

I think it sounds like there’s just a lot of opportunity also for collaboration among the different departments on campus, particularly when it comes to supporting international students, whether it’s international admissions or international programs or SSS. Can you maybe give some ideas or examples or just strategies for how career teams can maybe… Like, what a successful partnership might look like or how they can go about creating programming in partnership with some of these other departments?

Nitin Agrawal:

Yeah. So one right off the bat and very few institutions, and we work with a number of institutions so I can tell you very few schools are doing this, is really engaging with international alumni, or sorry, your alumni office, to bring international alumni into the equation. Because every year you have students that graduate, they are an OPT, they’re either going back home or at an H-1B employer. So how do you bring them back into the network to make it easy for your current students to find those connections?

So some schools do that obviously. There’s a very strong alumni network, but I think that’s a low-hanging fruit when it comes to facing students because again, even, say, if a student is unlucky in their job search and there’s hundred students from that country that graduated and went back home, now there’s network back home too. So you are giving them that backup strategy to find opportunities back home. And if not back home, if they’ve worked in a third country, it’s nice to understand what has the recent alumni accomplished so that you can repeat that same cycle with your current students or at least give them that path.

Ashley Safranski:

I love that idea of… I think that I agree that’s low-hanging fruit connecting them with recent grad, students who have done it before and are out in the world and doing well.

There’s a question related to supporting international students at community college. “So more and more international students are enrolling at community college. Given the resources, there are often minimal compared to universities. How can those working in the community college setting be more strategic about supporting international students in employment at the community college?”

Nitin Agrawal:

If students are looking to transfer after a couple of years to a four-year institution, there’s generally you’re not providing opportunities for full-time placements because that’s not what students are looking at. They’re looking for internships. And again, it’s looking at on-campus employment, any kind of unpaid internships, just to get them started on that path where once they’re at a four-year institution or even pursuing their undergraduate and graduate program, they have the past history of employment where they’re not going with a blank slate because if you have nothing on your resume, it gets very difficult to find a full-time opportunity. You just need to start somewhere. So just making sure during those two years or a few years that they’re at a community college, they are engaging in practical experience, not just classes and theoretical knowledge.

Ashley Safranski:

Excellent. I’m trying to keep up. There’s a lot of just great conversation in the chat and some great questions coming through, so I am definitely going to be sure to get through everything, so keep them coming. My friend Meredith is in there, teeing them up for me too, so I don’t lose anything.

I had a question around this idea of making sure that you’re… Again, going back to ensuring that students have the opportunity to engage with career services right off the bat. And maybe even before they even enroll, right? So I think that goes back to having resources on your website that are accessible and meant for that certain student population. Can you just kind of expand on maybe some strategies or commentary on how we can make sure international students receive equitable access to career services compared to their domestic counterparts?

Nitin Agrawal:

So you make a really good point, but say for example, again, at an undergrad level, when I was 17, I wasn’t thinking about a job. My goal was to get to school and all I was thinking about was partying or how fun four years away from home would be. And so just the level setting with the student’s mind in terms of what they’re thinking.

So if a career services advisor even calls a 17-year-old back home and they’re like, “Oh, I’m here to help you get started on your internship and career journey,” it’s a little too early. But for a graduate student, it might be huge because, say, someone comes here for a 12-month program or 14-month, if they can get that head start before school starts, that’s huge. And so if a current student or recent alumni can provide them that path, it’s like, “Look, I was only here for 12 months. It was really a tight situation, but you can get started on this process because the career services has these tools to start diving into all of this.” I think starting proactively also depends a little bit on the type of student and type of program as well, because sometimes it might not just be effective because students are not that interested.

Ashley Safranski:

What are some common misconceptions or maybe stereotypes international students that is related to career exploration and how can career professionals address these?

Nitin Agrawal:

Well, stereotypes are there for a reason, right? So there’s no misconceptions around stereotypes, I feel. I mean, it’s just not everyone fits into that bucket, obviously.

Communication, for example, is something that is always highlighted by employers that, “Oh, whether this student, because English is not their first language, can they write well? Can they speak well? Can they work in a team setting where communication is required and is highlighted?” And so just making sure students understand that and they see that as an important aspect of their profile when they assess their career readiness. So it’s not just a 4.0 GPA because with international students, again, academics is… Especially from some countries, they prioritizes so much more than anything else.

So what are other things within the career readiness that employers prioritize? So a simple thing could be, for example, hygiene. It can vary from country to country in terms of what is acceptable dress code. And sometimes if you go into a tech meeting with a full suit, it looks very strange. So though some of those things, I think, it’s important to explain to students what the etiquettes are, keeping aside academics, because academics is one thing where I feel like international students do pretty well, but just what are some of the other things when it comes to… And this is where the next career competencies I think are pretty good at breaking down what employers also looking at. Yeah, I hope that answers.

Ashley Safranski:

Yeah, no, it definitely does. I think I look to… There’s a lot of great content that is out there that even probably just talks about some of the really nuanced topics of hygiene, like how to dress for specific interviews. And I think making sure that as career teams, that content’s curated and served up to international students. And so sometimes you don’t have to always be the one to have those firsthand conversations, but making sure, again, back to ensuring accessible access to information, making sure that information’s teed up for them.

So I’m going to go a handful of questions and then we’ll get more into some of the ones that Meredith has teed up for me.

What advice would you give international students at career fairs to avoid confusing employers with questions like, “Do you hire international students or do you accept OPT/CPT?”?

Nitin Agrawal:

That’s the piece actually students can research on their own even before they go to. My advice to career officers would be to set up, say, depending on how large or small the career fair is, just setting up a small event for international students where you over some of the etiquettes around what to say, what not to say. Because when I attended career fairs as an international student at the university, I didn’t even know what to do there. So I took 20 resumes and I was just giving it away.

So it’s a little bit difficult for students to know because all these concepts are new as well in terms of what are you supposed to do at a career fair. So my advice would be to set up maybe a 15 minute or 30 minute chat, Zoom chat with students to explain to them what the etiquettes are and how you approach and what questions to ask, what not to ask. And at the same time, all the employers that are attending that conference, students can research whether those employers sponsor or not. So all that data is publicly available. I mean, if you’re an Interstride partner, it’s also on Interstride. It’s in their free websites as well that provides some of this information. So that’s something students should find out before they go to the career fair so they know which employers to talk as opposed to point to the employer and asking them, putting them on the spot.

Ashley Safranski:

Sure. I wonder if it seems like a great opportunity for cross-departmental collaboration. So career, reaching out to international programs, for example, “Hey, we want to host a pre-career fair zoom session for international students and we want to partner with you to answer some help set these students up for success and make sure we’re providing guidance on questions to ask and what to wear and all that stuff.”

Nitin Agrawal:

Absolutely. And just also maybe talking about work authorizations and for an internship, what would be required versus full-time opportunities?

Ashley Safranski:

“Admissions in many schools are very willing to invite international students here, but do not necessarily do a good job helping them understand OPT/CPT, H-1B, et cetera. Or even understanding that just because they have a US degree, they are not guaranteed a US job. Career services must often deliver the news, but often they don’t. Suggestions on how this whole ecosystem needs to change in messaging.”

Nitin Agrawal:

There’s a reason why admissions offices cannot highlight too much of the CPT and OPT aspect, is mainly because the Department of Education doesn’t allow higher ed to advertise the job aspect. If you remember, my first point was the students have to show ties to home country to prove to the US consulate that they’ll be returning home after the education. So they’re not here on an immigrant visa, they’re here to study and go back.

Same applies for universities. They can’t pitch this idea of, “Come to the US. Study and live here forever.” So that’s where the gap is. And so it’s not because admissions is at fault or they don’t do a good job. It’s just not their place to do that. But once they arrive, OPT and CPT, H-1B, all this is a bonus for students. And so that’s also, it’s actually a very good point for career offices to know and highlight. When students sometimes lose their cool and they expect the career offices to find job opportunities or placements for them, it’s like, “Look…” I mean it has to be, again, done very tactfully because you don’t want to turn the students against you. But that’s the reality of the situation where they are expected to go back home after they complete. But part of their F-1 benefit is that they can engage in OPT and STEM OPT. And the reason for that is also because there shortage of domestic talent that are studying engineering, for example, or computer science. So the US wants these international talent, and hence those programs.

So anyway, hopefully that answers it, but this is a role that will have to be fulfilled by career services. And the sooner you pass on that information to students, the easier it is for you, those four years or two years, because at ease students can start thinking what they need to do.

Ashley Safranski:

Right. Again, the early, yeah, that element of early.

Nitin Agrawal:

Early path, yeah.

Ashley Safranski:

There’s not the pacing.

Nitin Agrawal:

[inaudible 00:39:40].

Ashley Safranski:

Yeah.

Nitin Agrawal:

Actually, the big takeaway for all these presentations is if you can educate students during orientation, it’s half the battle because they know now what they’re dealing with. But sometimes you don’t have their attention and their focus during that time.

Ashley Safranski:

Yeah, definitely. It’s definitely no easy feat whether they’re an international student or domestic student to get them to think about post-grad that early. But it definitely, I’m assuming, would mitigate have fewer stressful conversations as you approach graduation.

There’s a question in the Q&A, I’m just going to read it verbatim. So, “While I give the same advice to domestic students, it seems international students are more open to taking any job. Not necessarily bad pay, just not what they wanted 100% in any state, especially if their time is running out., do you agree with this mentality as ideally the job will build skills and experience for them to eventually move on? Or should career coaches encourage students to take the job? Meaning student career coaches encourage students not to settle and take the job.”

Nitin Agrawal:

Again, your students have to be flexible. And we always tell students you can’t have a dream job per se and just be on hold about that job. So whether it’s focusing on a particular region or state or company or job title, as a domestic student, you might have the liberty of pointing into all those things and hoping it works out. And if it doesn’t, you can wait and try again or try for similar companies.

I mean, again, as the question stated, there’s a time limit to international students to stay in the country. So if you don’t get a job, you have to leave the country. And just because you want a certain job doesn’t mean necessarily you’ll get the job because employer also has to want you and sponsor you and you have to win that lottery and then you get to stay in the country.

With all those factors in place, it’s good to cast a wide net, but that doesn’t mean you just take any job. It still needs to be relevant to your degree, your major, your aspirations, otherwise you get the job three months, after you start the job, you’re depressed because now you’re in a foreign country doing something you don’t want to do. So just because you get a job and stay in the US doesn’t mean that’ll give you happiness either. And so that’s something to explain to students as well, “Look, you might get the job. But then what if you don’t feel fulfilled after six months and then now you’re in a place where you have to look for another employer?” So anyway, so those are other factors to think about as well.

Ashley Safranski:

Yeah, definitely a question that I’m sure comes up often.

Back to a really nuanced topic, and I think everyone on this call very much wants to support students but wants to toe the line and be careful to not offend anyone, right?

“So how do you best address the…” You brought this up about hygiene, right? Hygiene standards are just different in all countries. “How do you address that with students on an individual basis and how can that be done? Any advice for doing that in a delicate way that gets to the point across without offending?”

Nitin Agrawal:

I think the easiest way, and this is something at least works for me, and what I do is I will tell students that I used to do it. And even if I didn’t do it, but I want to highlight it as like, “Oh, I do it.” And I still do it with my employees where I’m like, “Oh look, I miss emails sometimes like this, but I’m trying to be better at that.” So then it makes it a little bit less offensive because you shift the blame on yourself, but still highlighting that problem in someone else.

And an easy way to do that would be to bring in, say, you’re presenting to freshmen and sophomores, you bring in a senior student who talks about their previous experience and you tell this senior student, “Hey, can you highlight these points as well? And just these were some of the things that you had to learn.” So it can’t be done in a way as like, “Hey, you are not smelling good.” So obviously that does not sound nice and no one’s going to take that favorably no matter how politely it’s said. But if you can do it in a way where you bring in someone else and they talk about their experience, that gets the point across. But if someone doesn’t pick up at that point, then it’s something really change.

Ashley Safranski:

Yeah, absolutely. And I love just that idea of bringing in a student who’s navigated the process well and can kind of share. Firsthand experience, right, often goes well.

Nitin Agrawal:

Right.

Ashley Safranski:

So I think that’s a good strategy in a lot of situations. Can you share some practical strategies to discuss the sponsorship with employers?

Nitin Agrawal:

Most employers, at least the large employers will either have… They’ll have policies around sponsorship, so there’s very difficult to nudge them to say, “Hey, sponsor me versus…” Because they’ve up their mind. If you’re Google, if you’re Facebook, if you’re Fortune 500 companies, you have a policy in place. And not just policies, but you also have a mobility team in place. So say a Chinese student applies to this company, they get denied in the H-1B, they’ll also have a relocation survey as is like, “Okay, we’ll move you to Toronto or Sydney or London.” So with large employers, I don’t think there’s a lot of sway there unless you have really good relationship and you’re working with the head of their talent team or something like that.

But small and medium-sized businesses, again, highlighting the pros of the STEM OBT program for example, and getting them at least acquainted with that idea before saying what the sponsorship can do. Because for someone who’s not sponsored in the past, it’s a little bit of a difficult journey because if you look at it, it’s still a lottery process. I mean, I’m spending time, I’m getting an immigration attorney. More than even the cost is the time aspect of it. It’s like, “Okay, we’re spending so much into this resources.” And last thing anyone wants to do is talk to attorneys. I mean, it’s as simple as that. You don’t want to deal with doctors, you don’t want to deal with attorneys. Just getting them on the frictionless path with it, which is OPT, STEM OPT, and, “Hey, if you love the student very much and this candidate does a great job, then we’ll talk about sponsorship. We’ll help you figure it out.”

This is where that employment lawyer comes into play where if you have someone in your role decks, you reach out to them and is like, “Hey, this employer is interested in sponsoring.” You connect them, and then they figure it out. But you somewhat have to grease the wheel a little bit to make it easy for an employer as opposed to just hoping they would do it all by themselves.

Ashley Safranski:

Here’s another just really practical question from Jen in the chat. “I’ve had some international students who have asked if they should go by a more American-sounding name to increase their chances of getting interviews. What are your thoughts on using a different name for resumes or applications?”

Nitin Agrawal:

I don’t know. That’s a difficult question. I mean, I guess my instinct is no one should have to change their name. But again, if that gives you an edge in the market, I mean, I’m sure there’s research around it. But I wouldn’t want to change my name just again to please someone or if someone is narrow-minded. It’s just like, I don’t see the point in changing my name just to get someone’s attention, which makes… And also, do I want to work with someone who is looking at these criteria? But some of these are unbiased, obviously, decisions. Yeah, I don’t have an answer for that.

Ashley Safranski:

Yeah, no, and I think totally agree. No one should ever have to change their name. I’m sure these are real questions that career leaders get. Would it be fair to just suggest… It’s personal decision, really, what do you feel comfortable with. But yeah, that is definitely a tough one.

Nitin, does Interstride offer webinars or videos for companies specifically on the employer side to get information about the OPT/CPT process?

Nitin Agrawal:

Yes. So we have an employer portal as well. These are for employers to fill hard to find positions because we are not telling them to post jobs on yet another portal. And the same portal, they have access to a tutorial video, they can access courses. There’s also access to immigration attorneys, so they can speak to one of the free attorneys that I mentioned directly from the employer side of things.

Ashley Safranski:

If you were to put a bow on things as best as you could and provide a summary, what are some just immediate things career teams could do starting next week or right off the bat to kind of quickly implement or spin up and start increasing their support for international students?

Nitin Agrawal:

Well, the biggest takeaway, and you’ve mentioned this couple of times, Ashley, is starting early. So focusing on orientation, or right when students arrive and highlighting challenges, opportunities, difficulties, whatever it may be in a way which is non-threatening and doesn’t cause more anxiety, but also highlights the reality of the situation. So students are aware and they don’t feel like they were sugar-coated. All this was told by the careers office.

Second would be bringing alumni into the job search piece. So how can you do a better job at engaging recent graduates, students who’ve gone back home and keeping them connected with your ecosystem? And then third, just being hyper aware of the needs of the students and not just… It’s a big group obviously at some of the institutions where you just tag everyone as an international student, but what are they actually looking for? What did they come with? What’s in their resume? And so everyone deserves a little bit of a unique guidance as opposed to, “Oh, CPT/OPT.” That’s not the answer. It’s, “Okay. What is the next step in your career?” So just understanding that piece a little bit better.

Ashley Safranski:

I love that. Those are some great strategies and things to consider. So I think I’ve gotten through most everything. Just considering the time, so I think we’re going to wrap up. Again, this was recorded. Tomorrow we will be sending out the recording via email and it will be accessible on our website and in the Career Everywhere community. Nitin, I want to thank you so much for-

Nitin Agrawal:

Thank you.

Ashley Safranski:

… carving out time to join us and share so much just in-depth information. I know this supporting international students, so many can feel everyone wants to do it well. And we all want to support students to the best of our abilities. So I appreciate everything that you shared to help us do that more effectively. And uConnect is just very glad to be partners with Interstride and the work that we can do together. So thank you so much.

Nitin Agrawal:

Thank you, Ashley. And great questions and thank you putting this together.

Ashley Safranski:

All right, everyone. Enjoy the rest of the week and good luck to a successful school year. Take care.